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Topic: KIU BPM change calculation, Of BUNKIS and STARTTIMES< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
17:43 CST :: 7/04/2007

valius
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Okay, guys... simple question for those who have done KSF BPM changes for KIU before.

Does anyone know how to calculate Starttime3 for the second BPM change in the KSF, perhaps using Bunki2?  I've no idea what the formula for this is... even though I know the formula for Starttime2.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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18:37 CST :: 7/04/2007

Turkeyslam
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You should paste all the stuff I told you on AIM.

A long explanation that I'm NOT willing to give again. -_-

19:23 CST :: 7/04/2007

valius
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So thanks to Turkeyslam's info:

Quote

(19:01:10) funbox64x2: just look at it with the perspective that you're layering three charts on top of one another with the end result of one ksf
(19:01:34) funbox64x2: don't look at a bunki as a point of a bpm change but look at it as a point of "switching the chart"
(19:01:59) funbox64x2: in this regard, starttime3/bunki2 is done pretty much the exact same way you'd find starttime2/bunki1
(19:02:19) funbox64x2: try making three separate charts covering all three bpms
(19:02:24) funbox64x2: one start time for each
(19:02:46) funbox64x2: but make sure that each measure is only used once by ONE chart
(19:02:59) funbox64x2: this will mean a VERY delayed start time for the later bpms
(19:03:19) funbox64x2: then when you get it to where there are no overlapping steps, then merge the three together
(19:03:55) funbox64x2: starttime = bpm1's start time. starttime 2 = chart #2's start time. starttime3 = chart number 3's start time.
(19:04:26) funbox64x2: the bunki would fit where the perfect gap is between the changes
...snippet...
(19:05:19) funbox64x2: bpm changes in ksfs are like a big game of catch-up for the steps
(19:07:15) funbox64x2: stepmania totally screws up ksf bpm changes when converting ksf --> sm because it treats it like bunki is the point where bpm A ends and bpm B begins
(19:07:25) funbox64x2: not the case
(19:07:44) funbox64x2: when a bunki hits, it doesn't necessarily need to be perfectly positioned where the two charts coincide at the same spot
(19:08:01) funbox64x2: look at my spring symphony and top city anthem charts for an example of "cheating the system"
(19:08:12) funbox64x2: at the bunki, the position on the chart teleports to somewhere else
...snippet...
(19:12:22) funbox64x2: it's easier to understand if you completely ditch the "bpm change" mentality
(19:12:38) funbox64x2: and think of it as two or three simultaneous charts running together and switching over
(19:12:48) Valius: So basically the three starttime is telling each stepchart when to start running, right?
(19:13:02) Valius: *starttimes
(19:18:52) funbox64x2: yeah
(19:18:57) funbox64x2: look at it this way
(19:19:08) funbox64x2: each stepchart has a solid non-changing BPM
(19:19:22) funbox64x2: you're just telling it when to abandon 1 and go to 2


I think that's a good enough explanation for now.  If I missed anything... feel free to hit me with a trout.


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18:53 CST :: 9/01/2007

Noodles
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*hits with trout*

is there any good bpm calculator? i mean for songs with bpm changes, like circus magic, etc.?


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02:41 CST :: 9/02/2007

valius
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For songs with BPM changes... an easier way would be to cut the audio into the parts with different BPMs and run the BPM Analyzer in the MediaDB on each part... but if the part is too short, the Analyzer may have problems, so WinBPM, also in the MediaDB, might be your best way of "manually" measuring the BPM...

Anyway, this thread speaks only on HOW to get BPM changes to work properly in KIU, since it's complicated, and it's assumed you already KNOW what BPM the change will change the BPM to.  Measuring the BPM you want to change to is an entirely different problem...


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17:08 CST :: 2/06/2008

ipodserver
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yeah :)

16:44 CST :: 7/26/2008

VanDamme
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Because of that hard part on doing BPM changes, and also the limit of ONLY two changes, I have gave up on doing steps for KIU and took DM as my new platform for stepmaking.

"So why don't you use SM instead, since it has more resources than DM?", some people ask me. Well... I find SM editor too complicated to use. And I'm used to make steps in notepad (you bet, I make them in notepad)


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20:54 CST :: 7/28/2011

FSX
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Okay. I never quite got this, but after looking at KIU's source, I get it now.

Basically, when a Bunki happens, the song's offset is changed to the respective STARTTIME and the BPM is changed as expected. This makes the warps possible.

7 replies since 17:43 CST :: 7/04/2007 < Next Oldest | Next Newest >

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